Hacker News

Here's how I do it with Heroku. Are there some cloud services that don't have an equivalent?

  heroku pg:backups:capture --app x
  heroku pg:backups:download --app x
  pg_restore --verbose --clean --no-acl --no-owner -h localhost -U postgres -d y local_db_for_robots_etc.dump

A little slow but on Aurora you can attach then promote read replicas. Iirc that's around 20 minutes but I haven't tested recently.

I'd think you could also setup logical rep to a VM then snapshot and clone the storage which is generally pretty fast.

I wanted to try doing something similar to this in our dev environment (think shared dev database but per branch clones), but this limitation seemed tricky to accept:

> The source database can't have any active connections during cloning.

I wouldn't mind some lock contention, but having to kill all connections seemed a bit harsh

Oh nice, the `/var` part of my workstation is a dedicated nvme drive and it's coincidentally formatted as xfs.

One of the main things people use us for is ease of testing writes on a per dev/agent basis which would be difficult on a read replica!

On the real world data impact I absolutely agree. We added something called "branch hooks" which essentially let you define SQL to run against the branch before it's returned

This lets you essentially anonymize and modify the branch to scrub unintended external side effects.

It's something that we're still working on though and trying to design the right abstractions around because we want to get that part right.

If it’s production data I probably don’t trust a random startup with it.

I’m very confused as to the target market here

We enable branching on any postgres DB through our architecture. So if you're on RDS, Planetscale, etc you can keep your DB where it is but also get the ability to branch with a full clone of the DB.

Neon does support copy on write branching natively and autoscaling compute but you make certain performance tradeoffs. A lot of the folks we've talked to that use RDS or Planetscale are reliant on things like query latencies supported by that platform's specific architecture but also want the ability to test on branches. We let you get the best of both worlds (branch but leave your DB where it is and freely choose your production environment based on prod concerns)

Supabase does have branching but they do not branch the data so you can't test any interactions that rely on the data. You can restore from backup as an option but this slows down based on data size since you're actually moving data as opposed to copy on write.

Longer term we want to be the place you branch all your data infra. So expanding to S3, Snowflake, MySQL etc.

For now though we're focusing on just postgres and getting it right!

We have ways to scrub PII/manipulate the data on the clone per branch.

It's called branch hooks and lets you register SQL to be run against the branch after it's created but before it's handed to you (or an agent)

So you can retain production shapes but manipulate the data however you want to make it safe

A true read replica won't let you write! So if you need to test something like a backfill and see if anything goes wrong you wouldn't be able to quite as easily.

We'd let you instantly clone prod + user defined auto-anonymization so you can test writes. The architecture also somewhat takes the place of an existing read replica if you want to use it like that to make it more cost efficient.

Also since we're using copy on write for the clones they're incredibly storage efficient and the autoscaling compute helps minimize cost on clones by minimizing excess compute uptime

Ardent adds extra dependencies and cost.

Evan here, from Ardent.

It's not uncommon (hex.ai, etc all do this, as do developers, MCP tools, etc). One thing we do at Ardent is enable obfuscated read replicas. We can strip PII in the replicas, so your agents are operating on realistic (but not sensitive) data. Moreover, they can do so in a way that doesn't impact your production database and is fast enough to wire into your CI/CD processes.

Jeremy is correct, though. The main risk/concern is primarily agents with write access. There are two high profile instances in the last year of agents dropping production databases (even when, in one case, after being given explicit instructions to never do such a thing). While read-replicas of a primary DB solve the "agents can't destroy things" problem, they don't solve things like testing schema migrations (in particular) or updates to the data.

Evan here, from Ardent.

It's not uncommon (Hex.ai, etc all do this, as do developers, MCP tools, etc). One thing we do at Ardent is enable obfuscated read replicas. We can strip PII in the replicas, so your agents are operating on very realistic (but not sensitive) data. Moreover, they can do so in a way that doesn't impact your production database and is fast enough to wire into your CI/CD processes.

Jeremy is correct, though. The main risk/concern is primarily agents with write access. There are two high profile instances in the last year of agents dropping production databases (even when, in one case, after being given explicit instructions to never do such a thing). While read-replicas of a primary DB solve the "agents can't destroy things" problem, they don't solve things like testing schema migrations (in particular) or updates to the data.

Business side people install Claude, find it fantastic, read about postgres and BigQuery MCP, and immediately demand it.

Small enough company without suitable MoC and they've got a real chance of getting it.

I'm much more worried about people who give full write access to their agents! But at least this solves that problem.

Would such approach work for MS SQL?

Sounds like thats all they’re doing.