Underarm Bowling Incident of 1981 (en.wikipedia.org)
96 points by EndXA 4 days ago
dvh 2 hours ago
> Bruce Edgar, who was on 102 not out, was stuck at the non-striker's end the entire over.
Now Americans can finally know how Europeans feel when watching baseball
pdpi an hour ago
It’s surprisingly simple, actually.
A cricket pitch is a long strip. Bowler bowls from one end, batter strikes the bowl from the other. Scoring is done by running from one end of that strip to the other (the unit of scoring is literally called a run). Six legal bowls make an over.
There are two batters in play at each point in time, one at each end of the pitch, and they both must run towards the other end of the pitch (therefore swapping places) to score.
Bruce Edgar had scored 102 runs, was not out (in the same sense as baseball — meaning he was still in play), but, because they either didn’t manage to score any runs, or scored twos, he spent the whole over on the non-striking side of the pitch.
senthil_rajasek an hour ago
Explaining Cricket to a Baseball fan only makes it worse.
I have tried it many times and failed.
Personally, playing a few games of cricket is the best way to learn the rules of the game.
As an example, in your explanation ( which is good to this lifelong cricket fan from India) your first sentence starts "A cricket pitch..." And when a baseball fan reads it he is probably asking "What is a cricket pitch?"
Eisenstein 36 minutes ago
So the batter runs towards the bowler? 102 runs? Can a run score more than one? What was the down by 6 thing? It's not really that simple?
Scarblac 24 minutes ago
Sniffnoy 8 minutes ago
I like this explanation of cricket for Americans: https://www.dangermouse.net/cricket/baseball.html
alt219 2 hours ago
As an American it has taken me nearly half a century of occasionally watching cricket to barely comprehend what that sentence means. I love it.
stavros 2 hours ago
As a European, what the hell is going on.
dchest an hour ago
gib444 44 minutes ago
Classic display of hoop-shorting and running wide and low, all while ignoring the reds on the board
The chums are going to rib him rotten over the cucumber sandwiches and tea in the wains room at half-over time
svat an hour ago
X, who was Y, was stuck at Z the entire W.
(Bruce Edgar), who was (on (102 not out)), was stuck at (the (non-striker's end)) the entire (over).
• An “over” consists of six opportunities to hit the ball and score “runs”. (A “run” is the basic unit of scoring.)
• "102 not out" indicates how many runs the player had personally contributed to the team's score. The number is large enough to suggest that this was the player who was playing particularly well in that match.
So the sentence is saying that the player who could be expected to make good use of whichever of those six opportunities he got, did not get any of them.
I think as with most cases of unfamiliar jargon, the sentence can be confusing not because of unusual words but because of everyday words being used with technical meanings ("not out", "end", "over").
esperent an hour ago
> Americans
Everyone not from one Uk, India... maybe Australia you mean?
roryirvine 16 minutes ago
Not even the whole of the UK - really only England and Wales (as a singular entity, rather than individually).
The rest of us know it only for its impenetrable jargon ("They've risked a woggle on the silly midden!"), the grating public school chumminess of the commentators, and a rumour about a puerile "joke" which may or may not have been told on the radio coverage in the early 1980s.
Honestly, it's a sport I suspect I ought to like - full of stats and strategy - but it really does seem impossible to follow unless you've been inculcated since birth.
gib444 20 minutes ago
...South Africa, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, West Indies...
shermantanktop an hour ago
https://restoringhopebhm.com/blog/wilt-chamberlain-and-the-g...
By contrast, underhand free throw shooting is legal in the NBA and it is very effective. But it is seen as unmasculine rather than cheating. Players would apparently rather lose than be seen doing it.
fallinditch 23 minutes ago
This ties in with something else on HN recently - the end of long wave radio in the UK.
Test Match Special was broadcast on the BBC's long wave frequency and for many people in Britain it was a quintessential summer listening experience: all day for up to 5 days per test match.
Such long time stretches of continuous broadcasting meant that the commentators were adept at talking, stories, banter and general chatter, occasional bollocks.
For me the Test Match Special broadcasts became like a pleasant ambient background noise to long summer days, with occasional excitement and humor - like the time Brian Johnston and Jonathan Agnew fell into uncontrollable laughter at a double entendre, a priceless piece of cricket history: https://youtu.be/KsVTpX7LdZQ
Brendinooo 2 hours ago
To someone who is coming in cold, this kinda feels like people saying it’s unsportsmanlike to kneel at the end of a gridiron game, or pass the ball around the backfield in stoppage time at a soccer game?
whycome 2 minutes ago
Or intentionally walking a batter so you so t have to pitch to them in baseball
raldi 2 hours ago
Taking a knee to lock in an American football victory used to be considered unsportsmanlike, but then the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_at_the_Meadowlands happened, where the Giants were up 17-12 with 30 seconds left and played normally. They fumbled the ball, the Eagles recovered it and scored a touchdown, the Giants' offensive coordinator was summarily fired and never worked in the NFL again, and ever since, dropping to your knee when it ensures your win is standard, accepted, and even sometimes called the Victory Formation.
zinckiwi 2 hours ago
There is still the remote possibility of a fumble or tackling the ball away from the defence in those cases. In the underarm bowling incident it was made physically impossible to win. In baseball terms, he had to hit a home run with the ball on the ground.
(Though as a non-American, I am indeed mystified why the kneel is legal and not regarded as delay of game!)
nkrisc 2 hours ago
Essentially the player with the ball is going down on their own, ending the down, same as if they had ran with the ball and been tackled.
They’re considered down when their knee touches the ground while in possession of the ball (“possession” having a specific meaning, with regard to the rules). Again, this is the same as if they had been tackled. The only difference is no one forced them to the ground.
Taking a knee is not something that would normally be considered a good thing since you lose yards and a down.
As for why it’s not a delay of game, that’s likely because it does not delay the game any more than any normal play would. It probably runs down less time on the clock than if they played normally, but of course playing normally is riskier which why they take a knee. The idea is to simply run down the clock as much as possible without risking a turnover and then leaving the other team with too little time to score.
If the rules could be changed to disincentivize taking a knee I think that would be more interesting, but I’m not sure how you do that. It’s also safer in an already dangerous sport.
bentcorner 2 hours ago
I am a casual American football viewer but my understanding is that the kneel ends the current play but keeps the clock running. Each team has something like 40s to setup their formation and snap the ball after the previous play has ended. If the game clock is still running (this is concurrent to their 40s of "setup time"), the team that is in possession of the ball can just use the full setup time (idk the formal term for this) to just run out the game clock.
Each team has 4 attempts to move the ball forward 10 yards, where if the ball moves >= 10 yards they get a fresh set of 4 attempts. These are called "downs".
If the team has any downs left when they kneel then they can maintain possession of the ball and can thus run out the clock. Most (all?) of the time the teams end the game even if there is time left on the clock.
Note that either team can call a timeout pre-snap which freezes the game clock. Certain plays also result in the game clock freezing between plays. There is also a 2-minute warning at the end of the 2nd/4th quarter that also freezes the game clock.
IMO clock management adds a very interesting strategic layer to NFL football.
kibwen 2 hours ago
Plenty of sports do have rules to prevent stalling tactics (either for sportsmanlike reasons or to make the viewing experience more engaging): the two-minute warning in American football, the shot clock in basketball, icing rules in hockey, etc.
notahacker an hour ago
Yeah.
Passing the ball around the backfield is a risky tactic in association football (which similarly banned the goalkeeper just picking up backpasses because it was too easy to waste time). 'Taking the ball to the corner' is a much lower risk option, but it is possible to win the ball back and quickly go up the other end and score with good play. Deliberate time wasting between plays is a yellow card offence (even though the referee could simply add the time on, it's disliked)
Plus cricket nominally has more of a sportmanship culture than most sports. "Mankading" (the practice of a bowler deciding to strike the wicket near to him instead of bowling because the runner from the other end has strayed too far[1]) is technically legal and would be considered smart play in many sports - especially since it's an action performed to stop opponents gaining a small advantage over you - but is regarded as shameful in cricket, at least not unless you've been gentlemanly enough to warn the runner at your end to stop straying forward each time the ball is bowled. Indeed it's so controversial Wikipedia maintains a 'list of incidents' page, starting with poor Vinoo Mankad who probably thought he was just being smart and didn't realise his surname would become synonymous with cheating https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mankading_incidents_in...
[1]baseball fans: roughly the equivalent of a pitcher deciding in mid-pitch to throw the ball to a base to stop someone stealing bases, except the base in question is right next to him.
kiddico 2 hours ago
Cricket will never make sense to me. That just seems like playing the game.
sejje 2 hours ago
It's a gentleman's game. Like in golf, there are expectations of behavior.
They didn't think they needed a rule.
This was what made me certain they were wrong--the commentary of their own older brother, who's hugely respected:
> As the ball was being bowled, Ian Chappell (elder brother of Greg and Trevor, and a former Australian captain), who was commentating on the match, was heard to call out "No, Greg, no, you can't do that"[10] in an instinctive reaction to the incident, and he remained critical in a later newspaper article on the incident.[11]
kiddico 2 hours ago
I suppose my fundamental misunderstanding is that an underarm bowl just seems like the obvious defensive move, not unsportsmanlike.
I said this in another comment and it seems relevant: "I know they're different, but in baseball the pitch is part of the game. Not being able to make good use of a pitch is a problem for the hitter, not the pitcher."
I think my baseballed mind simply cannot warp itself to your gentlemanly ways lol
notahacker an hour ago
srean an hour ago
Forgeties79 23 minutes ago
CamouflagedKiwi 2 hours ago
It's pretty much completely not like playing the game, because the batting team can't meaningfully hit the ball.
kiddico 2 hours ago
I know they're different, but in baseball the pitch is part of the game. Not being able to make good use of a pitch is a problem for the hitter, not the pitcher.
Now that I think of it telling a baseball pitcher that he could throw a pitch, but not too difficult of one at certain times is hilarious.
berti an hour ago
retsibsi 2 hours ago
gedy an hour ago
retsibsi 2 hours ago
In context, it was a bit like taking advantage of a videogame exploit that others variously hadn't discovered, thought was forbidden, or assumed would not be used by tacit agreement.
sejje 2 hours ago
No, everyone had discovered it.
This is like taking oddjob in the final match.
retsibsi 2 hours ago
cjs_ac 2 hours ago
A more serious case of unsportsmanlike conduct that was (and still is) within the Laws of Cricket: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodyline
tomlong 2 hours ago
No it is not still within the laws of cricket since the late 1930s.
You might notice the law changes section in that article, that amongst other things you can't have loads of fielders behind square on leg side now.
I would also suggest it is not considered unsportsmanlike to bowl short and aim for the head any more, but rather something people look foster's forward to seeing.
hliyan an hour ago
I was about to post the same thing when I noticed this comment.
For those who might not want to go through the article:
> ...designed to combat the extraordinary batting skill of Australia's leading batsman, Don Bradman... aimed at the body of the batsman in the expectation that when he defended himself with his bat, a resulting deflection could be caught by one of several fielders deliberately placed nearby on the leg side. At the time, no helmets or other upper-body protective gear was worn, and critics of the tactic considered it intimidating, and physically threatening in a game traditionally supposed to uphold conventions of sportsmanship.
mellosouls 33 minutes ago
As an aside, underarm bowling is the original style im cricket.
The overarm standard has (claimed) origins around 1800 in a lady cricketer raising her arm when bowling to avoid her skirt getting in the way.
patwards an hour ago
As an Australian, I feel like the Kiwis will always be able to hold this against us. A great shame
senthil_rajasek 37 minutes ago
In baseball, intentionally walking a batter to avoid a hit is considered "fair".
This incident was an intentional pitch (bowl) to a avoid a "home run" and in cricket it is sacrilege.
wolfi1 2 hours ago
don't know anything about cricket, know only about the beginnings of the writings by learned scholar Douglas Adams
RobotToaster 2 hours ago
The "hand of god" of Cricket?
alt219 2 hours ago
Not to take anything away from Maridona's overall excellence, but his goal was 100% illegal, just none of the referees saw his handball.
Underarm bowling was still allowed when this incident occurred and was therefore legal, just considered very unsportsmanlike and outside the spirit of the game.
retsibsi 2 hours ago
I think that's too strong. The underarm ball was a case of playing within the rules, but against most people's notion of fair play. The hand of god would fit most people's definition of actual cheating.
Hugsbox an hour ago
This article may as well be written in greek for how much of it I understand
CamouflagedKiwi 2 hours ago
This was pretty bad. Will never be forgotten in NZ.
Has probably been forgotten by Australia and everywhere else though.
wolfi1 2 hours ago
reminds me of the episode in HIMYM with the Minnesota sports bar
Forgeties79 2 hours ago
Dammit!
vonzepp an hour ago
The football (soccer) equivalent is someone kicking the ball out of play so that the game is stopped to allow medical attention to come on, and once the medical attention is over, the opposition taking the throw in doesn't throw the ball back to the other team. Occasionally teams have not done this, and scored a goal, shocked by this the goalkeeper will stand aside to allow the opposition to score an equaliser
retsibsi 2 hours ago
The Aussies were simply adhering to the TLC-Sirlin credo.
helsinkiandrew 2 hours ago
To those not familiar with cricket and why this is so scandalous the English/Australian/New Zealand phrase “it’s not cricket” is used to describe an action or behaviour that is “unfair, dishonest, or goes against basic moral principles”