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I can't believe people still believe Musk's demos. Can we wait with rhe excitement until this is actually real and in customer hands?

That is incorrect - there are three versions slated, one with no cold gas nozzles, one with forward-only (the 4 in the rear) and a tank in the rear "acceleration", one with 10 nozzles (4 under, 2 side, 4 rear) and a tank in the rear and passenger seat "flight". None of the variants use rocket fuel or other ignited propellent, they're all just compressed gas release systems.

This is explained in the deep dive video with Lars - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22rvpUecLts

> Ok, so it actually flies.

For a few seconds. It's a parlor trick. And the flying configuration will not be street-legal.

  > Tesla doesn't have a great record anyways.

>Ok, so it actually flies

I'm going to quote Buzz Lightyear: this is falling... with style.

On a serious note, this was unexpected. You can't deny, he has style

Reading https://www.tesla.com/roadster, it seems like both variants only use cold gas thrusters, and the difference is that the "normal" (lol) one only has them pointed rearwards while the flying one has them pointed in all different directions as well.

Where the heck did you see combustion based rocket engines? I haven’t seen that come up once. Was it an AI response? And the video feature only cold gas rockets as far as I knew.

Un incredible achievement that betters humanity. Amazing

There are three modes: Performance ($50k reservation), Thrust ($250k reservation), and Rocket (invite only). Thrust and Rocket mention cold gas thrusters. Where do you see a combustion rocket engine advertised? https://www.tesla.com/roadster

I suspect it "actually flies" much the same way the cybertruck is bullet proof and has an ultra hard stainless steel exoskeleton, in that it doesn't. This seems like smoke and mirrors conman shit pumped up to 11.

> kinda wild they devoted this much effort to an economically completely infeasible model.

Watch Ford v Ferrari for an idea of what auto companies are willing to invest for bragging rights.

The demo car they showed most likely has no batteries or even a metal frame. They basically built a car shaped drone powered by compressed air.

Example RC toy car that drives on the ceiling: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uR_mNcRlNsA

It is concept art and a bunch of promises.

I thought somewhere in the video they said that it is just regular compressed air that is held in a tank, and that the car itself has a compressor and regenerates the compressed air over time. Obviously to stabilize that amount of weight the gas has to be ejected at such a high rate it is practically frozen at the nozzle outlet, but it is still just regular air.

Tesla has a very good record for crashworthiness

And supercars are typically not submitted for NCAP testing, so It'll likely be less safe than a Model Y for example (to be determined, no reports out yet)

https://www.euroncap.com/assessments/tesla/model+y/0961/

It's not about sales numbers, it's about putting rockets in cars, so that SpaceX can acquire Tesla and give Musk supervoting shares

It's cool as fuck but calling it flying is misleading. It jumps and can maneuver in space.

Have they announce pricing on the rocket version? I could see it being priced like a bugatti or koenigsegg, where selling 100-500 of these is a great business.

> Wild that they devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible model.

Can't help but think of the not-a-flamethrower

(friend bought one for $500, now they seem to be worth $1500-$2000)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Boring_Company#Merchandise

> Wild that they devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible model.

Teslas evaluation is based on hype. This is as hype as it gets for a car. To me it looks like they were in need for "the coolest thing". To me, this has the smell of desperation implying the beginning of the end of their high evaluation.

> and one with real combustion rocket engines

The site states it's cold-gas thrusters for both models: "Features a multi-mode suction system paired with cold-gas thrusters positioned around the perimeter of the vehicle that support forward and upward acceleration as well as lateral rotational movement."

No chance it will get a permission to drive on the streets in my country. It also is a completely useless feature but it is still awesome.

Guess it is for advertising mainly.

> devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible mode

Just like economically infeasible Twitter, it has tremendous PR value. There is a huge economy revolving around people annoying other people just for a glimpse of their attention. This captures the attention and pleases people. Other car companies should start getting creative too.

They save on advertising to spend on mind-blowing demos.

The rocket version is also just cold gas thrusters, not carbon fuel based.

It's very economically feasible if it pumps up the stock price

> and one with real combustion rocket engines, the latter was in the video and is "invite only".

I don't think they'll sell these, at all in the future. No way they'll hound out actual rocket engines to en users. Too much IP in there.

Plenty of concept hypercars barely scrape 100 sales, the point is largley marketing in most cases

to be fair we don’t actually know yet that this is a high performance car. We only saw it drive a few mph without rocket assistance

> Ok, so it actually flies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhVLgTsoMhQ

>Wild that they devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible model.

It's only wild if you ignore Musk's role in this. Not even trying to bash him or anything, but he's a trillionaire. This is the kind of shit you do when you have more money than you can ever possibly waste.

I mean, if this is how he wants to spend his money, then I guess that's his prerogative. But I think it's a bit misleading to suggest this is a decision made by "Tesla" when this is clearly an irrational decision for a company to make. This is a decision made by Musk based on satisfying his own personal goals.

> .... into a high performance car

If that is what they have done. That may just be a large drone looking like a car.

> Wild that they devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible model.

You could say the same thing about the Cybertruck.

> Wild that they devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible model.

If this ships, it will deliver a fraction of what's promised here. My money is on the "flying" version being delayed repeatedly until it's quietly cancelled. Anyone remember the fast battery change stations[1]?

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oj6LaYFall4

The website lists three modes, which all have the fan but differ in thrusters. The variants are: no thrusters (thus no COPV), acceleration-only thrusters, and flying thrusters. The flying one has the disclaimer "Note: Not approved for public road use." OTOH the acceleration-only thrusters may be street legal. However, I expect that the COPV will be kept empty (thus not dangerous) unless you select a special "launch mode".

Hopefully there will also be a warning siren while it is pressurized. "Dangerous enough to need a warning siren" seems like a plus for the target market, honestly.

> Wild that they devoted so much effort to an economically completely infeasible model. I wonder if the combustion version will even break 3 figures sales.

It's staggering to consider how many resources we've diverted from people who could use them into building this novelty.

If ever there was a sign of a society of decadence in decline, it's that the most powerful person on earth is free to create toys like this exclusively for others in the ruling class.

Saw pictures of its undercarriage on Twitter and it looks like it well have been a empty shell of a car

https://mcmurtry.com/upside-down-driving/

I very much doubt the machine we saw flying was 1000kg+. It was either MUCH lighter, supported by cleverly hidden cables, or some other trickery. The dramatic lighting isn't just for visual effect, it makes it easier to hide the reality of the demonstration.

If there was a live audience anywhere near that stage they wouldn't have been able to use thrusters to fly something that actually weighs as much as a car.

This is not actually the first time that this idea of using a fan to create downforce. It's been something that's been talked about and modeled for a long while and I think a few years ago, the McMurtury Speirling was released. That set the lap record at Laguna Seca among other achievements. The car is about a million dollars, and the fans are basically completely useless anywhere that's not a curated track (think stones, dust, wood, other FOD going through the fans).

The new roadster is obviously cool, but it looks like a practically useless vehicle for 99.9999% of the population. It's purely going to be a track princess -- with lots of extra weight for frankly pointless (but very cool) thrusters.

Really doubt that demo was on a 10k kg car. It was probably stripped down to practically a shell for that trick.

> I definitely have my issues with Tesla and Elon but...

Sad that people feel the need to add this qualification. I see it regularly.

How much does the car actually weigh? It feels more sleight of hand than actually a flying car.

We've had rocket powered drone for 30 years https://www.youtube.com/shorts/NL1UF2bvaEM this is just a larger version

Maybe, but why? Feels like a slap in the face to people who have been waiting ten years for the car. Gimmicky demos just scream waste of money and loss of focus on what matters.

And that is precisely all it is, a demo. Reminder that BYDs are held at bay in an anti free market policy specifically because American car companies cannot compete with its low cost and quality. We're wasting time and money on this type of tech.

This engineering in this demo was only designed o get lucrative government contracts.

Is there any evidence/footage that this actually happened in front of a live audience? And not just on a screen that was shown to a live audience? Cause that's all can find.

Sorry for being skeptical but Elons track record of being honest at such demos isn't stellar.

[flagged]

I wouldn't exactly call it a demo.. more of a marketing stunt, albeit a very impressive one from an engineering POV.

I wonder what the point of this was? Seems likely related to anticipated purchase of Tesla by SpaceX. Maybe meant to (irrationally) justify a high offer price for Tesla?

Can't say I'm a fan of the styling of the car - I guess it'd look at home parked beside a Cybertruck, but something like the Porsche Mission S is way sexier.

Movie special effects has been doing this forever, lol

Quite interesting how things can be seen so differently, because this was one of the most pointless/dumbest demos I have ever seen in my life. There was no doubt someone could build something like this, the question is always "why"? What problem does this solve?

Sorry, but in world where the vast majority of people can't afford groceries, gas, housing, or healthcare... I just can't look at these silly things the billionaires are spending their money on and get even remotely excited about it. It's just so absolutely tone deaf in the moment we're in right now.

The funny thing is that during the event, Elon claimed that the car can recharge the tanks itself [0], but in the Top Gear video, the Tesla folks say that it is recharged from an external source [1]. In the Top Gear video, they also say that they are filling it from a "high pressure nitrogen system", whereas Elon claims that the tank is filled with air. They can't even keep their own messaging straight.

[0] https://www.youtube.com/live/qt5p-_tE8d0?si=V5csPghK02wwd0or...

[1] https://youtu.be/JdkIOhFmbKI?si=ULvyIRWDRZRWlIWA&t=1340

The stock market agrees. TSLA continues trending downward.

Also, the stock market's id, aka WSB is not impressed in hilarious and sometimes insightful ways. [0]

From my nerd POV, this looks super cool! From any other POV, ummm, what are we supposed to do with this? This is neat as heck, but you cannot put COPVs on public roadways.

[0] https://old.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/comments/1x73hxs/tes...

It's just a supercar. Supercars are allowed to be pointless.

That sounds fine. Charging time isn't the problem though.

It's a typical Tesla/Elon marketing stunt and nothing more.

In the video they claim the air is supersonic at exit, and point out the mach diamonds -- and I think they said 60 kilonewtons of thrust max, which is really a lot. So I think the volume of air would decrease roughly 60% from your estimate? I'm not a physicist.

I'm imagining this in two phases: phase one - you drive around, and excess energy goes to compressing air. Phase two - you use that compressed air which takes very little additional power, so you get to double up on force. I guess likely a 'running mode' where it's using some power to keep suction on.

I'm curious how much time you get at full blast vs 'just' enough to keep the car pinned to a wall, e.g. 1 vs 2 g.

You have the answer in your calculations, you just need to take to its logical conclusion. I say its was balsa not cartoon...

It _does_ go supersonic, otherwise the converging-diverging nozzle doesn't make sense.

> Back of the fag pack,

napkins, and envelopes at least kind of make sense.

Who was ever writing on the back of cigarette packs?

You an actually see what the pressure vessel looks like in the recent Top Gear episode.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdkIOhFmbKI&t=1239

Doesn't look too big, tbh. They also explain some of the mechanics used to make it happen.

> a big carbon-fiber pressure vessel at 5500psi

Other cars have these tanks, but full of flammable fuel, not just air.

Off the top of my head, the honda civic CNG (3600 psi)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_Civic_GX#Specifications

the toyota marai (10,000 psi hydrogen)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Mirai#High-pressure_hyd...

and probably the other cng or hydrogen cars.

Well, yeah. The full thruster version only seats one, and is invite only for purchase, and is not street legal.

> Let others do it, find out how late it arrives, what glued panels fall off at speed and wait for the inevitable recalls.

Sound advice for people looking for a practical car. But if you have Lambo money who cares? I have never seen a supercar described as reliable.

> what glued panels fall off

The Lotus Elise was famously glued together instead of welds. The original Roadster also had the same innards.

This is clearly not a car for someone who wants to go from A to B, but a lot of Tesla components gets binned together for the next iteration of the cheaper car because they always order too many of them.

Oddly enough this makes their cheaper cars more reliable than the expensive ones (think about the Audis right when Ferdinand Piech took over Lamborgini).

This type of vehicle isn't intended to drive at speed, at least not very far. It's targeted at collectors who will park it in a garage with their other supercars. It's a status symbol with wheels, not transportation or even a toy for track days. (And I don't mean that as a criticism, there's nothing wrong with wealthy people buying collectibles.)

Everyone is talking about the Cybertruck, but both the 3 and the Y have plenty of engineering problems as well. I believe both cars are listed as below-average reliability by CR.

Worse, there are no 3rd parties producing cheaper suspension parts, so your old Model 3 is going to have to spend 2000-3000$ on an yearly basis until you get sick of fixing the suspension. Tesla claims to have fixed the issue on newer models (and apparently they did a lot of work on the suspension), but they don't really take responsibility for their old cars so I doubt they will take responsibility when their design causes problems for you.

I do enjoy driving my 2019 SR+ Model 3, but I hate when people do the whole "Well on first principles, EVs have less parts so they are more reliable..." thing. My Toyota Sienna has been far more reliable than the Model 3, despite having many, many more parts.

That was my first thought, Cybertruck: The Car. But then it drove up a wall and stopped on the ceiling and flew down. That was awesome. I'm sure it will be a nightmare to own.

> glued panels fall off at speed

Given some of the tauted 'features' of this thing, I'd be more concerned about it blowing up in my driveway.

I liked the rounded one lots better:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/89/NextGenT...

(just personal preference)

Looks good? The previous version looked incredible. This looks like the Delorean and the Cybertruck had an unwanted child.

at least the CyberTruck shipped.

9 years since the announcement of Roadster v2, people who paid 50k deposits are still waiting.

Time to up the promises, and ask for more $50k deposits for v3!

I think the front view reminds me of the old lamborghini countach.

https://digitalassets.tesla.com/tesla-contents/image/upload/...

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/Lamborgh...

I just wanted to get one for $1mln I have laying somwhere, but now I'll wait for more reviews. Thanks for the tip.

Looks like a Fiero

“Configurations”

Like any of this will materialise. Where’s the original Roadster people actually put down payments on?

> every usable void in the car is packed with carbon-fiber overwrapped pressure vessels (COPVs) to store compressed gas

Hahah, the failure modes are going to be exciting.

What is the suction useful for? The engineering blows my mind but why would someone use this? Does it help on turns?

The rocket version is the real life bat-mobile to me. Impressive.

The flying-on-RCS-in-gravity reminds me of those old videos of exoatmospheric kill vehicle tests: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnofCyaWhI0

Patently absurd, of course, but amazing too.

Cool!!! Whoever thinks this is *not cool* please, leave your cool card at the door

This is something straight out of Rocket League. Completely impractical, but awesome at the same time.

What is the practical use case of this? https://x.com/JehovaTrades/status/2110906028971938252

I'll admit, that was pretty cool

Fast forward to 11:15 to see the tricks.

Some smart cookies put up a scam video topping Google searches for the announcement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5lmBq00utE

AI Elon pressure selling "act decisively, double your money" by transferring crypto to some wallet and getting 2x back - yeah, right

(PS Google shut it down)

> Car looks half decent too

To me it looks like a mashup of a Ferrari and a Cybertruck. That's not a good thing.

This would be a horrible deal for Tesla investors.

Long-term investors would lose about 40% of their investment to subsidize the inflated valuation of X (bought by xAI), the inflated valuation of xAI (bought by SpaceX), and SpaceX (whose valuation is based on the assumption that demand for inference is effectively unlimited, and that everyone will prefer hardware in space over Earth).

The valuation of both companies was inflated prior to acquisition, and Tesla shareholders will be asked to dilute their investment by absorbing that cumulative inflation.

Not even to mention that Musk would have exclusive control over the entire conglomerate, with not even the pretense of a Board to check his power.

When even Steven Mark Ryan is like "let's pump the breaks a little bit," you know it's bad.

Yeup. In 2025–

“Other shareholder meetings are snoozefests but ours are bangers. Look at this. This is sick.”

Elon’s pay package: he gets 400 million Tesla shares if he raises the market cap of tesla(xspacextwitterxAIx) to $8.5 trillion (nominal). He spent a cool 250 mil on making friends with the republicans, so as to ensure that his incoming epic awesome merger is not blocked.

A merger, plus the amount of inflation this government has already produced over the next decade, will probably see X co hitting Elon’s salary goals.

Yes, let's combine Twitter, an AI company, and a space company with a solar company, car company, battery company, and robotics company, so that we can have one huge valuation that can't be possibly delivered upon and losses will be absorbed for a short period. What could go wrong?

This is the the release of the Roadster introduced 9 years ago. This is what people who put down a deposit (upwards of 250k) back 9 years ago are in line to receive.

Incredible demo but I also have to agree, I will wait for the first Top Gear or Markus Brownlee unsupervised review before believing this project has been achieved.

Doesn't matter if the product is real. The idea is to cultivate a sense of wonder and adventure. To get people talking about you. Then you sell more of the products that are real.

Concept cars often having been run through either CFD or a wind tunnel and also haven’t been vetted for NHTSA requirements, and both those and coefficient of friction are why cars all start to look alike.

I can’t recall the vehicle now but there was a futuristic car around the turn of the century that had a lot of buzz, but changed dramatically for production and nobody liked it. But an engineer on the project said the concept car had less aerodynamic drag going backward than forward, which is quite an achievement.

That is one of at least a dozen experiences I have had that tell me not to get attached until the prototypes ship to car reviewers for examination.

It seems the 3 demos shown were even done with differing cars - it's likely that no single prototype car could do all 3 things!

I've recently come to the conclusion that Musk isn't selling products anymore, he's selling memestocks. He's a master of grabbing attention in an attention economy and it seems to be working out well for him.

This is so spot on. These things work in a bull market and we’ve been in a bull market for arguably 15 years. In a bear market the distortions that were created over the previous years are reversed and usually to an extreme.

It’s somewhat notable that Tesla was up significantly overnight and closed the day down 2%.

I wonder if this is the beginning of a very lengthy period after which people will look back and wonder “what the hell was everyone thinking?”

There are plenty of examples in the world where the one is all that is necessary. It's not like there are more than one Burj Khalifa building in the world. Many people pay for a one off car. There are multiple TV shows based on this very concept.

Just because it's not your hobby or within your budget, doesn't mean that others must feel the same way as you.

Steve wasn't an artist. Did Steve ship a product when Atari asked him to redesign pong into a one player game? No, that was Steve Wozniak. Jobs paid him a cool $350 out of the $5k bonus he got for that. Maybe he was an artist. Con-artist.

it's like saying, don't make no concept cars. No car manufacturers will follow that.

> it was vapourware. Period, full stop.

What sad reaction to a real life flying car.

Concept products are not real products. Their purpose is often to make a point, to prove something is possible, to make a brand look cooler, or just to have fun. I don't think I would ever see this car flying on the road myself. But part of me likes the fact that there are people out there making crazy things like this. It is more fun.

Yeah, not judging either.

Looking at the pictures, design-wise, I’m almost tempted to ask: “what was the prompt?”.

I actually think it's impressive that they have a prototype. It's less of a leap to think it could end up getting shipped. Whereas other competitors in the industry like Ferrari (Jony Ive collaboration) are launching cars with renders.

I think the event was a very Elon Musk way to say, we're not making a Roadster. Which makes sense, Tesla is leaning into completely self-driving cars and the Roadster as originally envisioned would be the opposite of that.

> I am personally not a fan of pure concept products that exist only to polish the company’s crown

I am. These machines push the limits of prevailing technology. Strong organizations set stretch goals and pursue them regardless of market viability. Sometimes they share this with everyone, and convention has named this practice "concept" cars. I appreciate when they take the risk to do this. And when they do it well, credit is deserved.

There are real engineers and technicians behind this. A lot of them. And they will tell the story of this event for the rest of their lives. I've known a number of people with such stories. They're among the best people I've ever met.

It is possible to exist without cranking the cynical knob to 11 at all times.

At least Elon's dealer is regularly shipping him ketamine on time, in quantity, and under budget.

It is pretty common for automobile companies to show concept cars!

What a weird thing to be angry about.

Disregarding that, all stuff that Tesla (and SpaceX) have demoed had become commercial products, so I wouldn't call Tesla a vaporware company.

Sure, it takes them decades ... but that's different from not shipping.

I don't get it. Musk has an insane track record of shipping things. Well later then he claimed but he usually gets it done. I'm not seeing anyone else leading companies that upended the domination of fossil fueled cars, paved the way for brain implants, build re-usable rockets and create global access to the internet.

Idk I’m a fan of companies doing really cool stuff even if they don’t sell it

"As methods for by suicide-by-wealth go, it's classier than drugs, and more accessible than a carbon-fiber submarine" -- some Reddit comment.

Concepts cars are cars.

What was shown on stage is closer to the Apollo lander training rigs than a vehicle that you could purchase and drive on a public road.

It can never, ever be sold as a production vehicle! The COPV gas storage is under enormous pressure, and would explode with the force of a decent sized bomb if damaged in an accident.

These things would be regularly turning their owners into pink mist, emulating Stockton Rush at a larger scale.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth_Coming_Out_of_Her_Well

It’s a CO2 canister with no battery or motors on wheels. What was incredible again?

Falling with style

Vroomba!

Square-cube scaling being what it is, I think it'd be much more reasonable to use propellers (like quadcopters) than try to scale down COPV's to a Vroomba! size. That's actually an interesting product idea. A small flying vacuum cleaner could clean a variety of surfaces; not only floors.

(And you could even mount the charging station on the ceiling, so it doesn't take up floor space).

All the dust around it on the floor would end up airborne again.

Roombas are already programmed not to yeet themselves off of stairs

Imagine walking up stair and suddenly a roomba launch itself at your face.

Yes, it isn't even special at all.

https://www.amazon.com/window-cleaning-robot/s?k=window+clea...

Fan cars are pretty old. From that perspective, the driving upside down part is "less impressive" but screw it, still cool.

I want to see it on a track going all out, but something about what they decided to focus on tells me nobody gives a damn about this actually doing anything performance car related.

When you get into an accident with another car, the explosion of that 10 kPSI tank behind your seat. will make sure you are the coffee. You know...Engineering...

Not spilling coffee during a roll is a solved problem: https://youtu.be/V9pvG_ZSnCc

Comes with a Stanley cup and a small cork

"gimbal cupholder" is what you want to google.

They're typically used to affix your beer to the steering wheel of your boat.

> I’m confused how this has (or will pass) regulatory approval for road use.

It won't.

And this is also true of being able to go over 90 MPH, despite many sports/premium cars touting an ability to reach a top speed above 150 MPH. Some cars come with "Donut" or drift modes. Donuts and drifting are definitely not road legal actions. These, and many other capabilities of sports cars, are obviously for track use only. These Roadster gimmicks are no different.

I think others have used a skirt that needs to extend quite close to the ground to work, so uneven ground can cause sudden loss of suction. Maybe this is solvable somehow?

I'm more worried about the COPVs exploding in a crash, for the thruster version. Hopefully it will keep the tanks empty unless a special launch mode is enabled with a warning siren sounding as long as they're pressurized.

The T50 has a fan for down force: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Murray_Automotive_T.50

what about like a countless random debris on the road? wouldn't that get sucked up and damage the fan?

> I’m confused how this has (or will pass) regulatory approval for road use.

Corruption? Musk is already down a quarter of a billions in donations to the GOP for these incoming elections.

Probably allowed outside of California.

The suction system is interesting. It's possible for it to work on the street but incredibly dumb. The kind of gap you have to keep is millimeters off the ground and your typical streets in the real world have so much damage and inconsistency it's hard to imagine it working for anything but straight line acceleration on a newly paved road. This would be a suicide mission to drive this on Skyline with the expectation to get 2-3g in the bends.

The concerns about debris and so forth are somewhat valid but can be taken care of. Similar to dust collectors for woodworking - this will have a cyclone separator, mesh, and whatnot that will prevent the blades from getting wrecked by a rock. But wouldn't want to tail this thing. It'll be pelting your car.

It'll be another "car goes really fast in a straight line" feature which electric cars have always done well with. While it'd be cool to use the suction system to get incredible g forces in bends - it'll be too dangerous for public roads. You'd immediately fly off the road if you lost any suction and I don't know what public roads (especially in the Bay Area) you could run such a system reliably on.

Is that "flying" car a "real" car? As in full battery and standard weight or is it just a shell stripped down to the minimum to save weight.

Because it makes zero economic sense to make a car do that?

It’s standard measure of acceleration. If you are going to sell a car on performance (like say… a sporty roadster), it’s a great metric.

People in the market for a car like this care far more about performance than they do safety, repairability or longevity.

That’s why performance oriented cars talk about their acceleration, and minivans talk about safety, and pickup trucks talk about longevity. Their target market determines which of the various metrics are going to be the headline.

It's just one stat and it makes for a good headline. Obviously those other things are important but they don't exactly fit into a headline. Oh and some people like fast cars. Why is that so confusing?

For the Roadster, it's a supercar. None of those things matter much.

For something like the performance versions of their high-volume vehicles, it's partially for the same reasons people like sports cars, or at least how some people like a sports car that is faster / quicker and gives them more excitement while driving (obviously a lot of the appeal for sports cars otherwise is the sporty look/sound of the engine, which Tesla doesn't really deliver on at all).

People are interested in speed performance. What other measure should we use?

You answered your own question in your very second sentence. “For a normal person”. The modern economy increasingly does not cater to the “normal person” and they prove this constantly. Granted “normal people” stopped existing a long time ago. You have poor people, soon to be poor people, and people who think they will soon be rich but will really soon be poor. Of course then you have the rest but they are not people.

Not to mention top speed. The US should have a federal or at least NY/CA state law that modern cars be electronically limited to 112 mph, as it is in Japan. There is no valid reason for a street legal passenger car to be travelling faster than that.

Speaking for myself I love the quick acceleration of electric cars because it enables you to safely pass other cars quickly on two-lane roads without needing to linger in the oncoming lane.

This is a sports car with a deposit that costs more than an ordinary new car, and with a price that would probably buy you a decent house. Nothing about this is meant for a normal person.

The more powerful the motor, the better the brakes and safety features.

I hope.

It matters a lot, when playing Top Trumps [1].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Trumps

It's one thing they can brag about, you know. Dumbing everything down to a single number, regardless of whether it's meaningful, feels impressive.

The vast majority of LLM users -- not the average person here on HN -- doesn't know which "model" they are using, can't tell the difference and don't care, including many software engineers. You could ask the same thing about those LLM benchmarks.

Bruh. Chicks man. Chicks dig fast cars.

Lots of words to say they built something useless to impress manchildren and investors, get ready for yet another "fell for it again" medal

It's a cool demonstration, I'll give them that. From what I've seen online, people don't even seem to consider whether or not they would actually want this, just because the novelty of it. I'd even ignore that and call it good marketing, if that's what they would actually try to sell here - but you need some kind of special invitation access to even get those, while they use this demonstration to boost the pre-orders for a car without the features everyone is talking about (or at least trying to, we'll see how many will actually go for it).

I'm reminded of that time that guy made the Statue of Liberty disappear.

They're probably all over X, but I wouldn't know.

The air tank has a feature called "only making like 10 of them... probably" which will significantly reduce the potential damage that could be caused.

Or, if I'm making up stuff as I go along, you can't crash, the car can just auto-takeoff to dodge whatever you were about to hit.

win-win for society.

This Tesla event was apparently performed in front of a live audience. Yes I'm sure there's a hype strategy here but equating this with the Nikola scam is a stretch.

Also Tesla events rarely (if ever) get followed by a durable stock bump.

--

Edit: Credible independent videos have been released on YouTube by reputable people. There's no doubt that the spectacle did happen as shown by Tesla. That's not to say it's anything more than a carefully staged spectacle, but claims that it's fake or AI or CGI are absolutely debunked.

I suspect this is going to be a Cybertruck/Boring Company situation, where we may get something ostensibly called the same and may even do something one could consider similar when squinting (maybe a bit higher than U9 jumps in scope) but with the specs and implementation differing so greatly that it shouldn't be considered the same. Exoskeleton vs body panels, 200kph+ on electric sleds vs Teslas (driven by human operators; tells you how much they trust their FSD tech) in a tiny tunnel, FSD on HW3 vs an upgrade maybe someday, etc.

And inevitably two groups will clash, one pointing out how much this deviated from the original, often decade long promises vs another pointing at the identical naming, how it's still a product they like and of course the all time winner "I don't see you do X"...

For what it's worth, I'd file this as a RCS demo for SpaceXGrokSI (or whatever they call themselves this week) above all else and if I were a betting man, might be a prelude to fusing them into SpaceXSuperXTeslaXIntelligenceX...

FYI the dawn project was debunked as crackpot scammers who had their feet on the accelerator pedal to fake an "FSD crash", along with a slew of other underhanded and misleading tricks.

this wasn't a promotional video, it was a live demonstration in front of hundreds of people.

dawnproject.com is a well known Tesla critic with commercial ties to Mobileye, a Tesla competitor.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2024/02/11/tesla-s...

Yeah no, something is very off on this and I cannot put my finger on it, the video looks odd to me. I want to say AIgen feel, but I only saw little tiny vids, rest were blurry as sin.

Any self respecting trader buys Tesla stocks based on this?! OMG!

It would encourage me to sell, if I had, seeing this nonsense.

SpaceX is the largest buyer of Cybertrucks. They've spent more than $100 million on them. Link: https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/elon-musk-buying-own-cyber...

Brother Tesla has been in decline roughly in tandem with Musk’s decision to stop masking

(To stop masking and start ‘musking?’)

A silent (and yet so noisy) cry for attention?

I agree. I remember as a kid getting so excited for Detroit concept cars that never hit the market. Now, unless something is actually for sale, I basically ignore it.

I suspect it's more because some rando could actually try to use it in public space. The invite only means they could send it to people who will give them good PR, are known not to be idiots, and can be invited to sign many responsibility disclaimers.

It’s way simpler than that, it’s just a collector car like a special edition Ferrari.

They have to sell one to say that it exists. It’s marketing.

Absolutely nobody who owns that vehicle will be “flying” it.

Most of us could never afford a roadster in any form, and just like to see cool stuff on the internet.

It clearly does not look like a smaller Cybertruck though. You're just wrong there.

It's moreover not the product that will be on sale.

It's a backpack company presenting the engineering of a jetpack to promote the sales of a premium backpack with the same name.

Man, why is this comment flagged when it's probably the most relevant in the whole thread?

Comments: Expectations set, expectations unmet. Fits a notable pattern by Musk of over promising and under delivering. In this age of misinformation, it's perhaps more painful than it could be if it were simply an amusing quirk of an eccentric billionaire.

And, speculation by Chris Norland YouTuber is the Roadster being fitted with literal rocket boosters is a portion of an argument to help justify SpaceX financially helping Tesla.

How dare people get excited by one of the coolest demos we've ever seen. These sort of comment are ironically almost entirely politically driven while also claiming anyone who disagrees is a secret Russian bot account.

The fact that this is not the top comment clearly speaks volumes of the current state of affairs in tech.

Well it is a separate rocket version, it just doesn't take jet fuel. "Invite only" for the rocket version means probably less than 5 will ever be made, if that.

Cold gas or not, these are still rocket motors.

Can't help but think of the super-large size toilet paper pack getting sucked into the fans...

I too solve my problems by getting catapulted multiple feet in the air without a clear landing plan

> Imagine you are about to get hit head-on by a drunk driver

The fact that Waymos don't get hit head-on by drunk drivers suggests this is a situational awareness versus last-minute dodge problem.

Makes sense, it was a Lotus Elise.

With a weird horizontal loop cut.

It's just a Lotus body, though I agree that Lotus cars are pretty

Not everything has to be about safety. Motorbikes are extremely dangerous. Wingsuits are absurdly dangerous.

Sports cars are designed to be impractical, but they can also be impressive feats of engineering.

I imagine the flying variant will be an extremely limited release and mostly just for stunts and shows.

Gas expanding faster than the speed of sound is called a shockwave - and the Mach diamonds are essentially the expanding gas shockwave “bouncing” back and forth as it hits the atmosphere, forming a standing wave of high and low compression zones.

I thought so at first but then Musk mentioned the thrusters can recharge themselves with pumps in the car. So it will actually be something owners can use repeatedly without needing complicated refills from Tesla service.

Not that I'd ever spend that much money on a car or need this at all, but for people who buy luxury vehicles I can see it. Definitely something we've never had in car history.

The Brabham was withdrawn after one race because it sprayed debris at following cars. I the thrusters used for better cornering also might push a car being overtaken just enough to get it off track. Even for track-only this won't fly. Not to mention blasting pedestrians.

What happens if there's a rock in the road and it gets sucked up?

We say McMurtry Spéirling this century :)

honestly both companies are getting good exposure here for relatively low lift on behalf of space-x team (it's a compressed air tank, nozzles and actuator valves).

They first started taking deposits on the Roadster 9 years ago in 2017 with a 2020 production date. It’ll be shocking if they ever sell this car they showed today. If they do, it’ll be many years late, not fly, and cost twice what they are saying. Just like the CyberTruck.

The one that doesn’t fly is only a $45,000 loan

Once was enough for me. The redbull stunts are way cooler. Check out Ken Blocks videos. Its an actual driver in an actual car. Not a plastic hull with 20 year old compressed air can technology attached to it pretending to be an actual product that will ever be made.

By all means, enjoy your Renault.

You should go look up the weight of a 911, Boxter, or Miata. And then, I suspect, you will not return here to reply to this comment. You'll invent some other reason why EVs can't be "nimble" or whatever, because it can't be your worldview that's wrong, it has to be the world.

This thing is covered in cold gas thrusters, I'm betting it can go around a corner faster than almost any other car. The limitation might be G forces on the driver. Maximum performance may only be achievable in self driving mode.

yes, you can, if you think like an engineer. they have suction mechanism, low center of gravity that helps you to beat any ICE counterparts.

You can't call this beauty of engineering a muscle car.

> when it weighs 1.5 tons.

Are you referring to the Tesla Roadster? Because, if not, I am pretty sure that most EVs, except for maybe small compact EV cars, usually weights 2 tons or more.

It has a steering yoke. F1 cars also have a steering yoke. Are F1 cars not fun and engaging to drive?

It also has steer-by-wire which makes the steering yoke practical as they can tweak the steering ratio to prevent the need to go hand-over-hand. As they did for the Cybertruck.

Also true of being able to go over 90 MPH, despite many sports/premium cars touting an ability to reach a top speed above 150 MPH.

Some cars come with "Donut Mode" or drift modes. Donuts and drifting are definitely not road legal actions. These, and many other capabilities of sports cars, are obviously for track use only. These Roadster gimmicks are no different.

And it begins. I can't wait to hear all the ways people will poo poo this incredible tech tomorrow.

Imagine driving on highway and suddenly a Tesla car fall on your car and kill the entire family

The original roadster was a Lotus Elise, all Tesla did was swap in an electric drivetrain.

Tesla has never really shown they can design anything compelling that doesn’t look like a lumpy shoe.

Tesla has been in the business of ugly cars for some time.

The one with the actual rocket engine is not being sold to the public and Tesla website explicitly states it's not legal to drive it on public roads. It's mostly just a cool demo/prototype and I'm sure there will be privately run tracks that let people drive one.

The generally available car will have cold-gas thrusters which boost acceleration but is nothing like what was demo'd.

And it's sure going to increase the blast radius when these get into a collision. Even if you can't fire the thrusters, that pressurized tank can't be safe.

Teslas already have very strict (annoyingly strict) gating keeping specific functionality off of public roads (Summon). The drag mode thruster-assisted boost will probably leverage that. I also imagine that cameras on the car would stop it from being engaged if it detects humans in its firing area even when not on public roads.

The flying trim will never be sold to general consumers. Even the rear-thruster trim is currently listed at a $250,000 pre-order fee, which is a deposit for a fraction of the full cost of the car. Final cost will be over $1M. Any of the thruster variants will be extremely rare; like, the one guy in your city that has one will show it off at car shows twice a year, McLaren P1, level of rare.

I’m no Musk fan but I found it cool and try to balance my negativity towards the person with what I’m seeing.

Plenty of ways to maim/kill people in traditional cars already and I doubt this will be the most common one in roadsters.

When presenting the world with a flying car, one doesn't need much extra charisma, the demo does it all. I think most people would be pretty excited (or full of themselves) knowing what they were about to show.

Tesla presentations (and Musk presentations generally) have always been weirdly awkward.

As an engineer who dislikes polished presentations of unimpressive things, it encourages me that it’s still possible to do a bad presentation about an amazing thing and (most) people don’t grumble too much.

really weirdly awkward

> it felt unnatural and cringey.

No way?! Elon Musk? Unnatural and cringey?!

Get a few cervical collars ready, first.

Why?

The suction can only work on a cleaned track. On a standard public road, they have to deal with capturing and disposing debris.

Thankfully this will never hit the road, it's just market manipulation.

Doesn’t matter, it can’t get wet

It's only incredible engineering once it performs in the hands of buyers. It's an incredible demo until then.

Who are you to decide it's not allowed any criticism at all?

It’s a spec sheet. It will be incredible engineering when it’s in the hands of customers.

This is a tech demo until it actually ships. Actual engineering requires things like cost effectiveness, reliability, and reparability that are yet to be seen.

It’s not like this is the first time that Elon has overpromised and underdelivered.

It is incredible engineering and also a enormous waste of effort by a car company that seems to have stopped caring about releasing cars for the mass market.

Engineering is practical, not self serving entertainment. This may be classified as interesting technological study perhaps.

"My heart goes out to you"

Uhhhh sure if rocket propulsion is fair game now? Seems a little overdone. Is my local DOT okay with this?

Based on the statement that the suction fan generates 2g of downforce, and the telemetry showing the fan operating at 4,700 kg @ ~95% load, the Tesla Roadster weighs approximately 2,300 to 2,500 kg.

I'm thinking the car from the Sega Genesis game "Outrun 2019" (and only a few years late!)

> other companies are catching up

Catching up? BYD has already surpassed Tesla and looks like the gap is going to continue to grow.

It is because he is very desperate for nerds to think he is cool so he lies and does PR stunts to that end and it works

Absolutely, but an even more likely explanation is that he's going to "acquire" Tesla with Space X and pay a premium (on top of the 330 P/E!). The SEC in this country is completely useless. Sure you can't invest in private companies if you're not an "accredited investor" but Musk is free to scam trillions of dollars.

Is this your first time seeing a concept car?

> One explanation is he is a trillionaire and the 14 year old in him

At this point it's not clear that there's anything other than a 14 year old in him. A greedy, sociopathic 14 year old.

More like they've strapped us to the chair, and now are dangling the keys trying to convince us it's our moral failing that the keys are in our face.

SpaceX uses convex optimizers, like CVX.

https://ocw.mit.edu/courses/6-079-introduction-to-convex-opt...

So the CyberCab will drive on the ceiling of the Boring Company’s tunnel?

This is bending over backwards so hard I think you had to invent new geometry and discover new dimensions.

Fan cars are old. Nothing about them is new or special or unique. Trying to build infrastructure dependent on such a feature would be the dumbest thing since monorails.

Just build subways for heaven's sake.

also parking.

> it's not that impressive co

you have to be pretty jaded to think a car that can fly through the air is not impressive.

They do happen to build the number one selling electric vehicle in the world.

Would you the same thing if it wasn't Elon Musk at the helm of this company? I'm not a big fan of him either, but I get the feeling some don't want to like this demo.

Also the public government funds being received are in the form of contracts. It's not like they can just use the money anywhere. Both Tesla and SpaceX are likely using private money (that is to say, funds not from the government) to fund this.

> it just feels like they are playing around with toys instead advancing humanity

You don't think electric vehicles and battery storage advance humanity?

On the contrary I would rather my big companies didn't try so hard to advance humanity. Elon has a lot of takes around creating a Utopian society which do not sit right with me. Really it's not the advancement that's the problem, it's the requisite power and resources necessary to achieve the elaborate visions. Humanity should be advanced by a collective, not by a few gifted individuals, even if that means more bureaucracy and less efficiency.

Nice way to insult Lamborghini ?

I think that's to do with the wake/vortices a helicopter creates. Apparently, the effect is so strong that it can affect lift in a fairly large area over a few minutes. There's a recent case where a light plane took off in the neighborhood of a heli that just landed, and it veers off course, and hits the heli.

there are approximately 450 in existence.. (ever made) Lets assume this car costs 1M each. (i bet its less) so if they sold 450 of these they'd make less than 500 million.

If they ever deliver a single unit that's a low enough bar to make it completely economically infeesable.

if they somehow managed to sell a couple of thousand... it might become profitable.

this has to be just a fantastic bit of marketing to jazz up their share price.

also.. I'd love to see a blooper roll of making it do these things...

Wasn’t stable. The straight jump they did was more like a mini rocket launch over some parked cars.

You’d want something that smoothly hovers rather than a launch then catch with boosters.

In the kickflip video it launches straight up and then proceeds to do a flip mid jump. The straight takeoff looks pretty solid to me.

I you sweep up an hedgehog, will it be thrown out through the exhaust?

Very cool stuff but all the "extra-terrestrial" stuff is complete bunk. This thing wouldn't survive Max-Q, let alone any kind of landing that isn't on a clean slab of concrete. It's a cool rich person toy, no other notes.

What is this wonderful "autonomous delivery vehicle" capable of delivering?

Also, assuming the delivery vehicle is destroyed at the end of each "delivery", what will it cost?

There is a video where it is flying over some other Teslas. Actually taking off, barrel roll and landing

It flies the same as a chicken. Cushion and long jumps but not flying as in flying car or plane.

There were multiple demos; its possible you only saw one, and then raced to comment about something you had incomplete knowledge about.

"It's not flying, it's falling with style!"

I think this is pretty unique demonstration for something that theoretically may be street legal one day.

yes it cushioned the fall, but not sure if it was overly modified beyond realistic car weight for production / public.

Yes, you missed the middle of the video.

I feel like it's also crazy irresponsible to sell this deathtrap to the public, since it's pretty much guaranteed buyers will joyride this on public roads.

- The cold-gas only version will shotgun debris into onlookers, and possibly yeet anyone behind it.

- Active suction is very cool until a rock punches through your intakes.

- Lithium batteries and pressurised tanks in the same package, yippee!

Thank god it'll take them years to manufacture this thing.

No kidding. Musk is SIX YEARS late on delivering the previous version of the roadster, which has been superseded by today's announcement, promising its delivery in a few years, and everyone is just lappin' it up.

Well we could examine the history here, for instance when he bought Twitter that it would immediately collapse (now its more popular than ever and Bluesky is the one that's falling apart) and when the Cybertruck was announced there were lots of people saying it could never be made: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21602437

Also let’s talk about the production of the video. It had all the signs of those magic videos you can find on YouTube where the trick is only a camera trick. Dark background, you never see the entirety of the audience, it’s all camera cuts. I’m sure it’s not fake per say but it’s super weird still.

Well I see no numbers saying how long it will fly. Perhaps it "hops", could easily see that happening with a burst of air below the car. (While standing still, accelerating the car upwards for 1 second with a burst of air)

> The thing that they showed off isn't something that they could legally sell

The cybertruck is for sale and FSD is active in the US. The US lets automakers "self-certify" that they are safe. So although I don't think this thing should ever be sold, it may end of on US roads.

My big question is, would anyone want one? It's an interesting life size hotwheels car but who would want one other than to show at a monster truck rally. The original Tesla Roadster was a masterpiece compared to this new one. Talk about missing the mark by a mile...

I suppose at least we can say there is a working car that seems to be able to actually do the things as advertised, which is more than one could ever say for e.g. the Moller Skycar.

McMurtry Spéirling is 900 kg with 1000hp and 100KW battery and 2000 kg suction fan.

Flying / rocket acceleration are special versions they can sell one offs capable of doing the stunt once per canister change.

That’s why it’s invite only.

I was #12 Tesla Roadster owner. I spoke across the country with my father. We drove from coast to coast in 2014 at a time when there was a lot of doubt. — I supported elons “mission” and now we know it’s a neo Nazi front of a company. This company and Elon has been a scam since he stole JB Straubel. How do I know? JB Straubel is my father.

Flying is obviously a gimmick, but when Elon said this will crush all track records he wasn’t kidding.

The base model has the suction fans which will make huge gains.

Next model up has rear thrusters for the acceleration, which will be more insane. It’s limited production.

Final model that can fly is invite only and will be a joke on the track, using those thrusters to go around corners way, way faster than normal.

I wish they had shown track laps and 1/4 mile times instead of the gimmick of flying.

If you wanted another pretext to merge Tesla and SpaceX this would be a good way.

The existing tech fab plus this car maybe makes it harder to sue once the merger happens - but he will still be sued. “Look we’re making it rocket cars with AI of course we should be one company”

I mean is it ever actually being released? probably not.

Was it a an amazing demo? yes.

What are you talking about re: the battery pack?

I think calling it a scam is a crazy thing to say. Tesla has never not (eventually) shipped a product they said they would .

Also yes you can legally sell it. Whether you can legally operate it is a different question.

I think it’s real, the “invite only” version could probably do the kickflip over the semis, but would probably completely exhaust the tanks and require special equipment to refill or take hours with an onboard pump. And the flip is certainly a scripted stunt, not something you’d actually be able to do live. The math doesn’t seem to be completely unreasonable as a one off demo

I wouldn't be surprised if the presented "invite-only" variant will mostly be aimed at Saudi investors, and they will get an invite if they invest a billion into the company.

This would even be a sensible choice for Tesla, because it will put that car in a garage far away from public scrutiny...

(thinking just about all the debris damage-potential of those thrusters here, not even any potential quality issues)

When I searched for Tesla on YouTube at the start of the event, the first live event returned was this, an AI generated Tesla presentation with Elon telling users to send bitcoin and he'll send you back double as a promotional event like an X Money thing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5EDp2rEbFA. The QR code went to this site: https://roadster.tv. I reported it to YouTube.

China has had flying cars since 2023 so I don't see how this is a scam. The flying mechanism is unique for the Roadster so that's still to be seen how it would perform out in public.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZpQZSBTi7k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2c-B3y7yGQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fU5viDOjWLw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSjXf7IUSDw

Rockstar better get to work adding this car to the game.

What kind of car doesn't have round wheels? This comment section must be the craziest I have seen so far on HN:

No, they're cold gas thrusters. The car has an air compressor, a composite overwrapped pressure vessel (COPV) and 10 nozzles.

in theory it could avoid car crashes in practice the dudes that buy these cars will probably cause more crashes;)

Misdirection only works if you cash in during the interval immediately after the misdirect before the subject can refocus.

Tesla Q3 sales will be the same tomorrow.

It doesn't surprise me that any particular companies sales are down at the moment, how does Tesla compare to other car manufacturers out of interest.

It's ok they'll merge with space x and basically be part of the US military which means sales figures won't matter anymore

Tesla board meeting last week: Board: So guys, our sales are slumping. What do we do? Elon: I have this cool idea...

> Tesla Sales Slump in Third Quarter

This isn't special though. 2023 was their best year and sales have been slowly declining since then. The share price has mostly been climbing since 2023. But soon they'll have a huge driverless fleet and robots or something.

I hope not, I use "full self driving" every day! I'm sure your statement is based extensive experience, but mine is that for 2 1/2 years over 40k miles, it has worked very well. Not perfect (parking spot selection has frequent regressions), but astonishingly well.

Why? I’ve sat in a self driving Tesla, with the attendant’s body rotated towards me while we chatted in Florida. What specifically is wrong?

This is going to be the next oceangate and I fully support it.

It's compressed air.

Great, now how about putting some of those amazing engineering brain cells into solving the impending water crisis.

https://x.com/itskyleconner/status/2110901867823718434

Invite-only variant can jump, not fly. Other two variants can't jump.

No they haven't? It can hop at best, in a demo unit, designed specifically for that demo.

No. Respect is earned.

$100M to boost Tesla shares by billions of $, how generous...

Hundreds of thousands of dead Africans may not be so happy he exists.

Even if it does, these features aren't useful and can't be used in any realistic scenario. At best they're just party tricks.

1. If you start flying and land on someone or something, that's a problem. 2. My strong bet is what they demonstrated is as far as the thing can fly, which is definitely cool as a party trick, but that's it.

These cars are obviously chock full of machine-learning algorithms to be able to control themselves in the air in that way. I'd much rather see that ML muscle used for something that actually benefitted someone.

Yes, Rodney Mullen invented the kickflip (and damn near every other skate trick), but the reference here comes from a time when Tony Hawk would drive around and yell "do a kickflip" at skaters, if they did a kickflip he would sometimes give them a signed board or other things. Example video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ob0dI05Xz8s - it became a thing for a little where people would yell "do a kickflip" at skaters they saw on the street.

> and other people

That's the bit where we diverge.

you already deal with this to some extent from others driving larger cars, everyone should be in a sedan

Very useful in England’s countryside, imagine all the puddles you can jump over! Eliminate these passing bays when cars can jump over each other in the narrow lanes!

Most roadways in the US are lined with wooden poles supporting wires with electricity running through them

It's a tech demo marketing presentation with a jumping car in it, not a flying one. It does look pretty cool though. Let's first wait and see if/when this will even be available and not just a marketing stunt.

It's apparently not fuel but pressurized air being refueled by the car itself.

> "Will it even be maintainable?"

Probably doesn't matter. I don't think it will be permitted on public roads anyway.

The presented variant is invite-only, so I guess it will be made to put in the garage of some (Saudi) investor who commits a billion dollar investment...

oh they'll assist breaking all right

To be fair, I think this is very doable with modern technology. If you've seen their rocket landing videos the technology is quite similar in nature.

The gimmicky part is not the engineering but the fact that it is not a flying car but a proof of concept of a flying car in a very controlled environment, with no regard for cost, with no actual viability of real world use.

Its like the breakdancing humanoid robots in China, a cool feat of engineering for sure, but it makes you think that robots can do human tasks, when the reality is much further away.

Air Hogs!

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Air-Hogs-Zero-Gravity-Sprint-RC-C...

> we would not be seeing such reactions even 5 years ago

5 years of broken promises and actively fighting to make the world worse will do a lot to opinions.

The main polarization with Tesla is between fantasy and reality.

Is this polarization or is this just people finally figuring out the grift after 10 years of "we'll be on Mars in 2 years"?

Why blame this on “polarization” and not on the guy who did the polarizing? Nobody forced Elon to do all that stupid shit that got so many people hating on him. He did it if his own free will. He ruined it.

i thought the top came off?

A lot of people responding to this thread saying to buy a cheap ICE vehicle.

Saving money on gas is only one reason to own an EV.

Other reasons include:

- rarely having to take it in for service

- never having to stop for gas when commuting

- a much quieter ride

- a much smoother ride (no transmission)

- instant torque

- no emissions

There are probably others I’m forgetting. But I can’t wait for the day I’ll not need to own an ICE vehicle (still better for long trips).

This is what used cars are for.

This is the natural flow of things. People with disposable income buy nice new stuff, suffer the rapid, early depreciation, and then they trickle down to the next tier of consumer who can't afford or doesn't want brand new things.

Cars and houses all work like this. Very rarely have the lowest income tiers ever gotten brand new, expensive things.

And if you're high income and smart, you still get used things because you recognize this is the most fiscally responsible thing to do and a great way to build and preserve wealth.

>> Nobody is offering this

They are, they just aren't allowed to sell in the USA. And they're looking to make the ban permanent [1]. Canada is getting some though!

[1] https://apnews.com/article/senate-chinese-ev-ban-elections-m...

So... you want a car that is:

1. New

2. Electric

3. Sub $25k

Drop any one of those, and you'll have plenty of options. This isn't about a K-shaped economy -- it's about adding significant constraints and being unwilling to compromise on any of them.

Also what's wrong with "loans for the rest"? Most new cars are bought with financing and have been for a long time.

If you don't need a lot of range, a used Leaf is pretty cheap as EVs go. Though you do want to avoid the 1st generation models (before 2017?) as they had much worse battery degradation.

Of course right now EV prices are probably inflated for the exact reasons you cite. Even with $4-5/gallon gas, an economical ICE can still be overall more affordable because you can buy them for a few thousand dollars.

Man you Americans, here I am with me 20 year old Mini and it works great I think it’s only valued at about 2k

There's multiple offering this, they're just banned from your country.

A used Model 3. There you go. They only start at $37k brand new.

If you can, wait for a Slate. It's not just cheap for brand new it's a company working hard to move the auto industry in an actually positive direction. I hope to make it my next car as well.

The idea of cheap, modular base and a focus on user accessibility/customization is in my view a very cool and sorely needed model in an industry that looks more about shoving in features, consolidation and ever increasing costs and complexity. Not to mention the rampant protectionism in the United States because Musk is terrified of Chinese EVs.

If you need a cheap car, then why buy new? Plenty of good used options out there, and sometimes more reliable than new cars

> Nobody is offering this.

They are trying. Inflation keeps moving the bar. It's not like they want their cars to be expensive; the components and fabrication prices just are.

Used you can achieve sub-25k easily.

To all people responding purchase a used car, I forgot to add that I don’t want to spend another 25k on repairs please

if only you could buy BYD in the US

If you can increase your budget to 30k, you could consider a Slate EV.

Electric cars are still an underdeveloped form factor, so it makes sense that you can't get a car big enough for many passengers that is cheap enough for your budget (the battery needs to scale for passengers/weight, so the market so far is tiny cars or big expensive cars. The middle comes as the tech develops)

Why does your neighborhood car have to be electric?

Get a Mitsubishi Mirage and pocket the extra $10k for gas.

What you want does not exist because EV buyers are mostly "look at me" types with deep pockets. That's why they're all luxury vehicles full of gadgetry. They build what the 90% customers want and you ain't it.

See: non-smart TVs etc.

> I need a cheap car. Sub 25k

Here’s one place with 26,000+ cars that cost less than 25k: https://www.carvana.com/cars/under-25000

Used EV's can be had for sub 25k all day long. The Slate is also technically sub 25k

It's a shame the infrastructure is so poor in most of the US that a high end electric cargo bike isn't an option most people will consider. I love mine for exactly those use cases.

Sir, you're in the invitation required vehicle discussion.

Check out the Nissan Ariya. I see them for around $20k for a 2023 low mileage model.

China is offering this. Guess why they got banned though.

Dacia Spring is around 20.000 €‎ in Europe. LE: I realise you're not in Europe, so my comment is not very useful — on the contrary.

Get an Elantra, keep the difference to pay for gas.

There are lot's of affordable Chinese cars, but US doesn't want them to be on our roads.

You could but the government won't let you buy one from China.

Adam Curtis had a great line in the 2016 doc HyperNormalisation [1] about Donald Trump turning Manhattan into a playground for the rich from the ~70s-00s.

Now we're turning everywhere into a playground for the rich. The sad part is that they're unimaginative and in such poor taste that it gives you pause about the dynamics of human hierarchies. Wealthy people used to be dignified; I'm not quite sure what you call today's crop. Insecure chic?

[1] https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p04b183c

Was just in Europe and saw plenty of smaller / cheaper EVs. Unfortunately they're not offering them in the US.

The Slate is probably the closes to what you want.

A cargo e-bike is a good solution too, if urban.

Just get a used Tesla 3

Hyundai Inster.

That's like commenting about needing a Chromebook on a post the newest Blackwell GPU that can serve inference workloads of thousands of people. Just irrelevant.

Tesla's efforts on the original Roadster made them be able to transform the whole EV industry to the point that EV's are nowadays actually affordable. Not everything is exactly about your specific needs, and you shouldn't shout people down when they're lifting the whole field.

I do not get this kind of complaint. Every thing you consider an important part of your life today (including cars and smartphones) started out as toys for rich kids. Complaining about it is asking to go back to the stone age, because all the advancements since were brought to you by someone's desire to make money and someone else being rich enough to afford it, till economies of scale made the poor old you able to afford it too.

there are more and more cars that close to that price, look at kia ev3, or ioniq 3, or BYD

amen!

The Slate car with SUV add on should do the job I imagine

Several Chinese brands (like BYD or Xiaomi) have such offerings, but the US is too beholden to Musk to let them in.

And then Musk has the gall to claim India is not open to Starlink because Ambani is in charge! https://twstalker.com/elonmusk/status/2108604227643719745

Like someone said, you're asking for too much. Decent used sub-10k cars are available for your purposes https://www.carmax.com/cars?price=0-10000

Twitter wasn’t bought to conceal the loss in valuation. It was bought so Elon can influence the populace with his narrative.

If you still believe FSD doesn't work, you're operating on outdated intelligence. Frankly, like a boomer saying that email doesn't work.

Seriously, I bet these are the same people who were shitting on the Hyperloop!

The time machine actually accomplishes something. I fail to see what this accomplishes other than a very cool circus stunt. Straight out of fast and furious. Which is great and all, but not a production car.

You forgot the part where Doc Brown purchased parts for the vehicle through funding by terrorists.

Yes, Elon Musk and Doc Brown are really, really comparable. Great metaphor. Who can forget when Doc Brown famously stole a bunch of government data? Or tried, numerous times, to overthrow democracy? Or bought a heavily used social media site to turn it into a propaganda box?

What a well-thought out comparison. You've definitely got something, here.

Well this isn't real so that's not a very good analogy. I also don't think Doc Brown (who's also not real) was famous for committing fraud and lying habitually to manipulate the market.

They really should have paused the video mid-flip for a quick voiceover.

We can discuss the demo without acknowledging this because it has literally nothing to do with the roadster.

Just cuz you're not impressed doesn't mean only bots are. That's a hell of a demo, and a sweet looking ride to boot.

You gotta admit the car looks nice compared to the Cybertruck, and the technology is indeed impressive. I think it's an organic reaction, unless they're defending Elon personally.

This is another expensive marketing gimmick nevertheless, and I'm struggling to see the value of it, especially when Tesla is not doing that well.

Still waiting for the underground maglev highways and buses, coming any day now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j70GvgXt-lE

Which accounts posting in this thread do you think are bots?

I'll bite. What do you see as applications of for commodity cold gas thrusters? Excluding rockets.

More important to signal that they think Elon is a nazi, apparently.

> just endless anti-tech hate, downstream from idiotic TikTok politics.

The hate and politics obsession of the people you're complaining about on here pales in comparison to the guy doing this presentation. He is doing it 24/7 I'm not even sure he sleeps he is so engaged in it.

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The car is not using momentum and centrifugal force to stay on the ramp. It has fans providing tons of downforce - so much downforce that it's able to stick to the road nearly completely inverted

Re-watching it, the wires are on the ramp. Part of the support of the loop.

I never thought I would say this, but.. have you been like.. born 70 or something?

Bro the car literally jumped over a semi like its the TF2 soldier. Nothingburger???

Amazing such instant expertise.

Watch the video - the car jumps into the air. Not exactly flight or what we’d consider a flying car, but it’s careering through the air off the ground.

This isn't even the first car to demo holding and driving upside down using a ground effect fan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6LYcgaQ46c

It's supposed to be funny. Or it's not? Really not sure.

There is another car [1] with a fan to improve downforce.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Murray_Automotive_T.50

Watch the livestream

> Bullshit, no it can't

I mean, this isn't crazy. In fact, it's already been done. Ever heard of McMurtry? (https://mcmurtry.com/). They're notorious for exactly this - using fans to provide extreme downforce (urr... upforce if you're hanging upside down?).

> In flight?

Did you see the stunt where it literally flew over vehicles? I mean, maybe it's a bit closer to a controlled super-leap like the original Superman, but... yeah, my personal reaction to that was more "holy shit" than "well, that's not flying".

If you scroll down on the page, it shows that the "rocket edition" is invite-only. Probably gonna sell it to a few friends in hopes that the 3-5 they make sell for millions down the road, so to speak.

>> Our multi-mode fan and ground sealing system acts as a downforce generator, pulling air out from beneath the vehicle. This provides enough suction to hold the vehicle upside down, even when stationary.

> Bullshit, no it can't.

A proof of concept already exists:

https://mcmurtry.com/upside-down-driving/

That’s if it doesn’t kill you

Well, think you're only seeing the most splashy uses. For instance, at high speeds, could use the thrusters to first, increase acceleration and speed, and second, have them also able to do a bit of thrust vectoring to help push the car's tires on to the pavement for better traction. And then on turns, have thrusters firing to help push the car into the turn.

Also, maybe the car is able to hover for short to medium distances, which for a military and offroad vehicles, could be very useful to cover all types of terrain

May come in handy if someone blocked your car on a parking and you don't have time for the tow truck to arrive. Or when you're stuck on I-95 during a major snowstorm.

Yeah, I mean how are you even going to get a family of seven and a dog in there

Let's get real, the entire point of a roadster is to look cool and have good sensations. Try to beat that!

If you want a sensible car, get a Toyota Corolla, or a Model Y if you want to stay with Tesla. They will get you to your destination just as well for cheaper and with more space for your stuff.

Super

Tesla has been doing this for a while, having all their promo shots at night etc. The terafab announcement stuff has an especially dystopian vibe

The Robotaxi just started rolling out beyond Austin a few months ago. You think they threw together a flying car on a whim in a matter of weeks?

Don't worry, the first time they drive through a city the fans will suck up some trash and ruin the motors

He may have done it to improve the optics of a potential Tesla–SpaceX merger.

Tesla with FSD is 8 times safer than other cars.

Tesla Model 3 and Y are some of the safest cars to have been tested in history. Obviously, a flying car is not meant for the mass market.

https://www.euroncap.com/assessments/tesla/model+y/0961 https://www.euroncap.com/assessments/byd/atto+3/0992/